World of Speakers E.78 COVID-19 Special : Vinh Giang | The show must go on


Average: 5 (1 vote)

World of Speakers E.78 COVID-19 Special Vinh Giang

Ryan Foland speaks with entrepreneur, motivational speaker, and magician Vinh Giang. Winner of the South Australia Young Entrepreneur of the Year award, Vinh left his professional career to create a platform to teach magic to students from around the globe. 

In this episode of our COVID-19 special series, Ryan and Vinh discuss the state of the speaking industry in the COVID-19 situation that we're all in. Vinh shares his story about the path he took to take his venture online, the hurdles that he faced, and how he was eventually successful. 

One of the key messages in this interview is to adapt to the situation and realize that your content may need tweaking. If you are able to break your content into modules and deliver them virtually, companies still have budgets for that these days. 

Tune in for an interview chock full of insights on how to pivot to virtual, to adapt in these testing times of COVID-19. 

Listen to the interview on iTunes or Soundcloud.

Subscribe to World of Speakers on iTunes or Soundcloud.


Vinh Giang: Hey, this is Vinh, I just did an amazing podcast with Ryan for the World of Speakers podcast. 

We spoke about the state of the speaking industry in the COVID-19 situation that we're all in. 

We spoke about kicking, cutting cardboard, and also my emotional meltdown as my business disappeared and disintegrated.

Ryan Foland: Ahoy everyone, we're back with another special edition COVID-19 World of Speakers. 

I have a special guest, he is a magician, and more than a magician he is a showman. I originally had Vinh on my radar from a buddy who said, 

"You've got to check this guy out." 

And so I followed him. 

I ended up sharing the stage with him in Texas, and we connected. He obviously had to jump out of town for the next flight, but I did a little research, I joined his mailing list (as you should do with speakers who you appreciate and that you want to connect with.) 

Then I saw an email about how his class was going virtual and I'm like, "I want to check this out." 

And my mind was blown because he had such an amazing 5-day course that made me feel like I was there with him, and that is why after the course I said, 

"Vinh, I need you on my podcast so that you can help people understand the transition that you've gone through to help people bring themselves up and understand the power of the vocal instrument, which is yours to play." 

Ladies and gentlemen, Vinh Giang.

Vinh Giang: Wow, I feel like you're going to play like an applause cue.

Thank you, thank you very much, thank you.

Ryan Foland: You are good at getting applause. 

You had a false ending in Texas as a keynote, and you got a standing ovation, and you're like, "No, no, no, guys, sit down, sit down, I'm not done yet." 

That was great.

Vinh Giang: It was hilarious because I even threw in the line, "You can stand again if you want to at the end," and they did, which was hilarious. 

It was a double standing ovation. 

But yeah, it's funny I go from that to coming home to my wife, and she makes me cut cardboard boxes and do the dishes. 

She refuses to use the dishwasher when I'm home because I am the dishwasher when I get home, so it's a nice grounding thing.

Ryan Foland: It's good to know that you're human. 

Well, I'm excited to get people to learn from you today. Specifically, a little bit about your journey, because I think it's an amazing story that we can all be inspired by. 

But also how you've been cut off at the knees, like the rest of us, and you've made what I see as a very successful transition to a virtual environment that is super interactive. The way you use breakout rooms, the camera set-up that you have inspired me to totally rearrange my office. 

I'm like geeking out on all these Blackmagic switchers, so I'm excited for everybody. 

But to kick into it, tell us a little bit about your back story, because I think it's fascinating. 

And from what I learned about your storytelling skills, I am confident that it'll just take a minute or two and you'll enthral everyone.

Vinh Giang: Oh the pressure is high. 

No, but look, my journey really began about 11 years ago. 

I still remember I was fulfilling the Asian prophecy, I was studying commerce and law to become an accountant or a lawyer at that point. 

And I had 6 months left to go in my degree, and I remember going home and telling my parents, 

"Mom, Dad, I want to quit university." 

And obviously, my parents were pissed. I remember my dad looking at me going, "What the hell, you want to be Harry Potter?" 

And no, I didn't want to be Harry Potter, I hate Harry Potter, but they actually freaked out, but they, in the end, supported me. 

Because they saw how unhappy I was in my job, they saw how miserable I was, and my dad initially valued security over freedom, overdoing what you love because he knew war. 

So it took a lot of communicating. It's one of the reasons why I'm so passionate about teaching communication, it's because it took so much communication between my dad and I before he and my mom went, 

"All right, we've been valuing security over happiness, and we forced this on you." 

And there's a great quote by Carl Jung I'm pretty sure, I think it's Carl Jung, he said that "The greatest burden a child must bear is the unlived lives of its parents." 

And my parents had all these dreams of theirs that were pushing on to me. My dad wanted to do accounting and law and he's pushing that onto me. 

So when we communicated and he saw that, then that allowed me to pursue the journey of becoming a magician, and those were just the happiest years of my life. 

And I ended up performing as a magician. I built an online business teaching magic tricks, and we won some entrepreneurial awards with that, and out of nowhere I got asked to speak. 

And I remember the first time they said, "Oh Vinh, because you won this entrepreneurial award, you have to speak at 10 different events to represent the country," so I was like, "Oh, crap, what am I going to talk about in this 15 minutes.” 

15 minutes! Now you can't shut me up. 

And I did that first 15 minutes and I was like, "Wow, this is amazing!" I loved it. 

But I was terrible when I started. I am pretty sure most people didn't really love it.

But I fell in love with this industry. I'd never done something that feels so fulfilling. 

So then I went all mad scientist, then I read every book I could on how to build a speaking career, I shadowed every speaker I could find, and now I find myself living in the U.S., speaking. 

Well, I used to. I've stopped now, not because I wanted to but because of COVID-19.

Ryan Foland: Well, I have no fear that you will continue to be worldwide regardless of where you actually preside. 

And as speakers we all have our journey to get to the stage, and a lot of people can relate in that story from parents and understanding. 

But I think that the magician part of it — and I've seen you and I've heard you say it a few times — that this idea of showmanship. 

I like to play with people and say, "If you speak in public then you are a public speaker, it's a scientific fact that you cannot argue either." 

And you really helped to highlight that, yes, everyone's a public speaker, but to be a professional is a whole new level. 

That's what I think really came through on your course, is that you have the information that you can share, but it's really up to the person who takes that information and applies it.

And to steal your thunder from one of my favorite quotes that you repeated a number of times, and you have to let me know if I'm somewhat accurate, 

"To obtain information is to be satisfied, but to apply that information is to be fulfilled."

Vinh Giang: Very close. It's, "The acquisition of knowledge brings about satisfaction, but it is through the application of knowledge that brings about fulfilment."

Ryan Foland: Awesome. 

I love the fact that there is the knowledge out there for people to speak.

I mean, you are a mad scientist. You went out there and got it. Now you're just repackaging it to what makes sense and works for you. 

But we're all now in this boat where regardless of your training, regardless of your prestige, regardless of how much your fees are, we're all in the same big boat. 

I want to transition into how that has impacted you, your mentality. A big part of the final message of your class was really that you have this voice that is your instrument, and what you are going to use it for? 

So how is this weird COVID-19 transition happening? What are some of the processes that are getting you through it?

How did you so quickly jump to this virtual environment? 

What I'm going to tell people is that it was a very successful jump. 

It can always be improved, but tell me about this weird journey that's happening right now.

Vinh Giang: Yeah, if you start at the beginning, I did my last event early March. 

And when this whole COVID thing came along I was like, "Oh, the only thing this is going to affect is China. It's not going to affect us here in the U.S. It's not going to affect us here in Australia, surely not." 

And before I knew, within 2 weeks, my entire diary for the remainder of this year just wiped clean. 

My business is based on events, and I've got a couple of coaching clients, but I had two coaching clients, one decided to cancel as well. 

So I lost the entire speaking business. It kind of went under. 

The entire workshop business I could no longer run. 

And one coaching client decided to cancel too, so I was like, "Wow, this shit did definitely hit the fan and it's going everywhere." 

So I panicked, man, I freaked out, I couldn't sleep, came to my wife, worried, "I'll be ruined," I had a bit of a cry, it felt good. 

But then after I panicked and flayed around for a good week, the entrepreneurial DNA kicked in and I really feel that I am an entrepreneur before I'm even a magician. 

And the reason why I like magic is because I love problem-solving, because magic is just a problem you can't solve. 

That's what it is.

Ryan Foland: I like that.

Vinh Giang: That's what it is, it's just a problem. If I do a trick and you don't know how it's done, it's a problem you can't solve. 

Now, just because you can't solve it, it doesn't mean there's no solution. 

So to me, that's what I felt. I felt like, "Okay, right, so this is just some magic trick gone wrong."

It's a terrible trick, COVID-19, but there's a way through it, there's a solution. 

And how do you solve a magic trick? 

Well, the toughest pieces of magic, magicians only perform for you from one angle. We never let you stand behind us, we don't let you stand right next to us, you have to stand in front of us. 

So to me, the way that magicians solve other magicians' puzzles and problems is we look at it from many different vantage points. 

So I started looking at the speaking business, my workshop business, from many different vantage points. 

I started speaking to tech people who run the majority of their business online. I started talking to a friend of mine who runs Australia's largest golfing community and his whole community is online, "Future Golf". 

And I started talking to these different people to gain a different vantage point. I spoke to video people, streaming people, and went,"Oh, right."

And that's when I started to see, "Oh, there is a solution to this." 

However, just because you read about how to swim doesn't mean you can swim. 

So to me, I read about all of this stuff, and then I just dived in and drowned in it for about 3 weeks. 

That process with the learning curve was really, really steep, and where I just wanted to give up time and time again when I couldn't get the cameras to connect to the computer, couldn't get the audio to stop echoing, couldn't get the audio levels up, like so many problems, the mindset component there was keeping what Charles Darwin said front of mind. 

It's not the strongest that survives, it's not the most intelligent that survives, it's the one that's most adaptable. 

And the other thing that I kept in mind was Bruce Lee. I love Bruce Lee. Bruce Lee has this wonderful quote where he says, "When water goes into a teapot it becomes the teapot; when it goes into a cup it becomes the cup. Be water, my friend."

I have these quotes stuck up on my wall and it's just, all right just flow with it man, stop crashing everywhere you're going, start to just flow with it. 

If it's a shitty day it's all right, it's a shitty day. Just stop, go inside, eat some chocolate, watch some TV, and just relax and play some Call of Duty.

Ryan Foland: Cut some cardboard and do the dishes as well. Just in case your wife listens, I just want to make sure.

Vinh Giang: Yeah, I tried to sound cool, "I can do what I want." No, no, no, when I go in I do what the wife wants me to do — husband duties.

What was interesting was just to be kinder to myself in the process. 

And when I crashed and when I hit a wall I would often beat myself up and go like, 

"Come on man, just stick at it, stay for another 10 hours, what are you doing, you're a loser, you're an idiot, you're weak." 

But I just became kinder to myself, I was like, "You know what, maybe today I just don't have what it takes. That's cool, I'll come back and I'll fight again tomorrow." 

Sometimes in battle it's important to retreat so you can prepare and fight another day. So to me, I allowed myself to retreat anytime I felt like I was losing. 

I was like, "Oh, I'm losing, I'm retreating." 

And that's what got me through it. It's just “get the vantage points”, know that this is just a problem and there is a solution to this problem. 

If you're kind to yourself in the process and just keep trying to get every day, new day, fresh day, start again, you'll get through.

Ryan Foland: Was there ever a point where, as a magician, you see another magician and you have that same approach?

Now I know that you've built this huge training so you probably know all the tricks, but is that truly a magician's approach to problem-solving, knowing that magic is just a problem that you are not aware of how to solve?

Vinh Giang: It's the sad journey of the magician. Where most magicians when they get into magic are like, "Wow, magic is so cool," you're so mystified by it, and then you learn magic and then you realize it's sleight of hand, it is not real. 

And then you get crushed by this awful feeling of, "No, there's no magic." 

And what's funny is you go through that journey and then you realize in the end that the magic is not what you do with your hands; the magic is the reactions you're able to get in the audiences you perform for. 

And to answer your question, absolutely, I love magic for that reason. 

Other magicians love it for other reasons, I love it for the problem-solving aspect. 

I love it when a magician does something I don't understand, it drives me crazy, but I love it. 

Because now I have something to work on. I love tinkering, I love sitting and looking at things five times in slow motion and reverse. I love it.

Ryan Foland: And I think the takeaway here is that a magician's approach to problem-solving is all those things, and that's exactly what we all can take on, the idea of getting the different perspectives, digging in, being nicer to ourselves. 

Well, I'll tell you, whatever that process is for you, worked from the outside, because I didn't know what to expect in your class and I was super impressed with your ability to create a stage-like environment. 

And in all transparency, as soon as I saw that I'm like, "Oh god how did he do that," and at a certain point during the class you're like, "I'll tell you everything. I'll give you all my setup," and afterwards I got lost on Facebook trying to find your group — I'm not a Facebooker. 

But you emailed it to me, I'm like, "It's just there." 

So you've helped me to gain those perspectives. 

But can you describe your setup. Not necessarily technical, but I can describe it from my point of view. It was as though you were on stage and you had a side stage where we could clearly see you writing. You did up-close magic with us, you even had a side sarcastic camera which I love, and if you like the Daily Show you know everyone likes to look 90 degrees stage left and have like a little sitcom-y.

Tell us about your stage set up and if you're listening as a speaker from an audience perspective, it really was more than just a Zoom, it was more than just sitting in front of a computer. 

How did you come up with that or how can you describe it for people?

Vinh Giang: Well thanks man, I feel like I have to wear a neck brace after that kind of testimonial. 

But look, I have a five camera set up. It's a bit excessive, but to me, when you're innovating, when you're exploring what I believe the virtual world right now is, what I deem to be the blue ocean. 

For those of you who are familiar with the book "Blue Ocean Strategy," I see you got a picture of a beautiful blue ocean behind you. 

Blue Ocean is essentially the Red Ocean marketplace. A highly competitive marketplace, people are competing against each other, often competing on price and racing to the bottom. 

A Blue Ocean is the appearance of an entirely new market where competition is not an issue because there is no competition. 

So to me, the virtual world now is a blue ocean marketplace which is this huge opportunity there that we can talk about afterwards. 

But when there's a blue ocean, what you must do is you must be innovative and you must break things. 

And you must push things too far. 

In Australia, we have a saying, "How do you know how far you can go if you don't bloody go too far?" 

And that's the thing, I'm trying to push/break it. 

So I bought the cameras that I did not need to buy, I've definitely wasted money, but thank goodness for return policies. 

I pushed the boundaries, so I've got five cameras, each with a different purpose. 

One camera is for the course of magic, so my point of difference as a speaker is I use magic on stage as well. 

So you got the magic camera. 

Then I've got the main teaching camera which is the main angle we always go back to. 

Then I've got the side sarcastic camera you're talking about, that's a camera for me to be cheeky. 

When you're on stage and you want to talk to the audience you may be doing your presentation but then you step to the side and you go, "I didn't really say that."

You have that little bit of conversational dialogue, so that camera, the third one, is for conversational dialogue. 

The fourth one is for the flip chart. So I've got a flip chart that I use. I've since upgraded, I've got a Samsung flip 2 now. A Samsung flip 2 is a 55 inch TV screen you can turn vertically, and I'm using that now. 

That's the fourth angle, and I've got another angle as well which is a super-wide shot, and that's for me to be able to teach body language, because I do teach body language in the workshop. 

Each camera has a purpose, so don't be mistaken if you're doing this to go, "I am just going to have lots of cameras." 

The camera has to serve a purpose, otherwise it can be a distraction, because I think the golden rule in virtual communication and communication in general is that, if what you're doing distracts people from the message, it's a problem. 

And if you just keep changing camera angles because it's fun, and it's not purposeful, it then becomes an annoying thing. It gives you a bit of a headache. 

So that's what I'm doing. I've got five cameras, I've got a Blackmagic ATEM 80 EM switcher that I use, and that allows you to plug all the cameras. It allows me to plug an extra laptop in so I can move between the cameras, but also move to my laptop as well, which shows my slides. 

So you can have that familiar feel of a slideshow. 

And that is all being controlled by a Blackmagic switcher, which is fantastic.

Ryan Foland: It's magic. You must love it. It's got magic in the name.

Vinh Giang: It's why I bought it, basically. 

They're a very good brand. I can't preach them enough. They're fantastic. 

Essentially that's what I've done, and I've turned my entire garage into a bit of a studio, and feel free, Ryan, to share that link I shared with you to all your listeners as well.

Because I drew a diagram out for all of my students about how all my devices connect together, what cables you need, and I also linked all of the gear there too. 

But what I will say right now is don't buy some of that gear. 

I went too far.

I've realized instead of spending $25- 30,000 I could have spent $10,000 or maybe even $8,000 or maybe even $6,000 to get such a good set up.

Ryan Foland: Yeah, it really was impressive. 

And what I want to clarify for people listening is that now that the Blackmagic patch is out, it actually patches into Zoom as though it is one single video feed. 

And what you did is you took control over your video and I just want to say that again, it's not like you were sharing a screen, because whenever you share a screen it takes over the other person's screen which is kind of aggressive and it makes it so that like your face is tiny. 

You were taking over the actual Zoom video, and I think that was unique, and your use of that with the breakout rooms really made it so that there was involvement and activity the whole time. 

Vinh Giang: Yeah and that was such a critical piece. 

Now there's one other piece of gear that I've just discovered, so this is hot off the press. 

What you're talking about there Ryan, it's called a virtual camera. 

The Blackmagic, after all the cameras go into it, it then sends out one video feed to your computer which then acts as a webcam.

However, Zoom is very good, but just discussing security files, if you update to the latest Zoom it doesn't accept virtual cameras. 

Now, all the cameras go into the Blackmagic, The Blackmagic has one cable that goes to the computer, but before that cable goes into the computer you've got another device which is called a Blackmagic Web presenter, and what this does is it turns the signal immediately into a webcam signal, so then when you go to your Zoom, instead of saying facetime camera it will say Blackmagic Web Presenter. 

And you click it and you're in. So this was the missing ingredient that drove me insane. 

So just to understand that the switch goes into the Blackmagic Web Presenter then goes into the computer and then you are set.

Ryan Foland: Brilliant. 

And I love that you're open to sharing all this stuff. I believe in abundance, that's why I started this podcast so long ago, it's just to share best practices because it's all there. 

Now I want to know what you think the future holds for the speaking industry, and I want to just preface that you have been at this for a long time. You've got top-notch fees, massive stages at companies that are at the top end, so you've got a nice perspective of what it was.

If you could rub the magic genie lamp and be the genie that comes out and answer the three questions: what's going to stay, what's going to change, and what do you see on the horizon?

Vinh Giang: Anything that I say right now is 98% going to be wrong. So please, as they say, take it with a pinch of salt, please take mine with seven buckets of salt. 

What I will say, and these are just thoughts so please I'm no expert in forecasting or anything, I really believe that live events are not going to come back until 2021. 

I don't think they're coming back until mid to late 2021. 

I think if we want it to come back earlier, we're being very hopeful. 

One of my big clients, Microsoft, they already made a massive announcement that there are no more live events until July of 2021. 

And seeing the music festivals all cancelled this year, so that's why I'm thinking the next 12 to 18 months it's going to be fairly quiet. 

And if you're getting anything, it's going to be very small groups of people coming together. 

I also see, and because I'm fairly close to the marketplace right now, still with my management company, and this is literally news from today's meeting, I can share with you that event budgets are all evaporating, because events have ceased to even exist at this point. 

So their budgets also have ceased to exist. 

However, training budgets have not disappeared. 

So if you're a speaker right now and you're able to change your content into modules and deliver them virtually, companies still have budgets for that, and I've got many proposals out right now with companies which are very large contracts, it's 4 or 5 times my speaking fee for a series of virtual sessions. 

And the reason why training is powerful is because I was on a call yesterday with a drug company, they were saying, 

"Vinh, we want this training you're doing for 3000 people, but we want you to do a live training for 100 of our top leaders, and then we want to record that and then share it." 

The beauty of them wanting to share it is you can say, "Well, sure, I'll charge you a fee for presenting those 5 workshops with 100 people but then I'll charge you also licensing."

They go, "Yeah, sure. So please send it to the 22:24 22:26 the licensing is, and then we go beyond the licensing. If you're open to it, we'd also like you to do Q&A with our team afterward too." I'm like, "Yeah, sure, you can do 22:34 and sure I'll do the Q&A for free if you take all of this."

So what I've realized about the marketplace currently is that a lot of the event organizers are scrambling to try to innovate with tiny budgets, and to me what's going to happen with that is the experiences they create virtually with a tiny budget, it's not going to be very good. 

Ryan Foland: Unimpressive, yeah. 

Vinh Giang: It's going to be unimpressive. 

And then as a result of that, the entire company goes, "Well, virtual is crap. This is nonsense, we're not doing this again. We're going to sit this out until things get better."

I feel most people in the marketplace will not do virtual well, which would then give virtual a bad appearance, and as a result of that, all these conferences that I want to go virtual will only be the big, big, big companies that go virtual and do it really well. The smaller companies will probably not even do an event, and now just do training. 

So we are seeing training budgets get beefed up and event budgets diminishing. 

And in training they look at it differently because they think about it as an event. They're looking at it from an experiential point of view. 

That's why they get keynote speakers, they're experiential, right? 

Whereas when it's virtual it's difficult to be experiential. 

However, with virtual what they see is this platform is being primarily used for education, training. So to them, it still makes sense to do virtual for training. 

So to me I see it as lots of training will happen virtually. Companies are realizing they can get speakers like you to come in and train people and they get to keep those videos. They’ll pay a licensing fee. 

Whereas before we used to get Bob from marketing to do a training video and it's terrible, Bob's terrible at it, wouldn't know how to work a webcam, and then it's just awful audio, awful lighting, but that's how they have their internal training, whereas now, they can bring in experts to do the internal training. 

That's a huge opportunity.

Ryan Foland: So knowing that we are going to be digital for a while, you did have a section in your training which is just a real high-level list of things to remember as a speaker to present digitally. 

So I'd like to close out the show with this list. 

If you're listening, some of these may seem simple, but I believe that this simple advice is the most powerful and I think you are on the same page with that. 

Also, the caveat that my karate instructor taught me a long time ago is that practice doesn't make perfect, perfect practice makes perfect. 

And I know you covered that in a class and I was like my ears are perking because I was drilled in that as a martial artist from a young age. 

So it's one thing to take the advice that Vinh is going to give you here and be like, "Oh yeah, that's basic, I know that." 

It's another thing to actually take it seriously, practice with rigor and with professionalism to actually make that difference. 

Because I think whatever's going to happen for the next 18 months it's going to be about excellence in the details. The difference between who's going to and who’s not going to get the deal is going to be a very small margin and you're going to kick yourself if you don't put that effort in. 

So what are the top tips that you've got for people when it comes to digital presentations? 

Vinh Giang: I think you have to engage vocally and physically first of all.

To understand that it's not just you talking, and just because you're sitting in a house by yourself so often we get stuck in the mindset of, "Oh, it's it just me, I'll just talk to you like this," and you drop your volume and many of you listening right now, this is kind of how I talk. 

But imagine this is what I did for the last entire hour, or 30 minutes that we spent together. 

Again, it's not engaging, so you've got to activate your voice. 

Activate your voice and activate your body and then the best way to do that is to stand. If you're not used to it then stand, make sure you stand, that's something that's helpful if you're not used to it.

The second thing is to make sure you look at the camera and don't look at yourself the entire time, I think that's a mistake I made when I started doing this as well, you keep looking at yourself and you go, "Oh, my hair is wrong" or whatever, you've got to be careful with that. 

Make sure you smile. This is what I got from one of my good friends, Mark Bodom. He reminded me and he goes, 

"Vinh, just stick out a little smiley face next to your camera to remind you to smile and remind you where to look." 

I would also say what's really important is mic yourself well. Make sure if you've got to move around, get a lapel mic. Don't use a mic that sits on the table and then the further you walk away all of a sudden it sounds like you're gone now. and then you come back again — don't do that. 

Make sure you use a mic that is a lapel. 

Lighting — very important. 

Make sure you've got good lighting. Use natural lighting if possible. 

And make sure you practice. Make sure you rehearse before you do it. 

Before I ran the five masterclasses that Ryan was a part of, I rehearsed each masterclass at least 3 times before I did it, as if it's a normal presentation. 

And when you rehearse for it, what will happen is the student experience would be better, which means that more people will hear about it. 

Because the most powerful lesson I learned in the world of speaking is that the more you speak, the more you speak. 

And what that means is the more gigs you do, the more gigs you get. 

There's a rule there: The more gigs you do where you're great, that's when you get more gigs. 

The same thing applies to virtual. If you have a great experience, and I'm so grateful that you asked me to do this, Ryan, but if the experience wasn't great, I wouldn't be here telling all your listeners about it.

Ryan Foland: Exactly. 

Vinh Giang: That was terrible, I want a refund. 

So the thing is that mastery is critical even on this platform. 

And don't look at this as a substitute, look at virtual as an entirely new thing. 

Most people are thinking to themselves, "How can I turn my keynote into a virtual experience?"

No, no, no, how can you design an entirely new experience? 

This is a whole new product, it's a whole new product and that's how I think people should view it. 

And then those are just some high-level things, but when you get the basics right and you get it right consistently, that's very powerful. 

It's like again, Bruce Lee. We begin with Bruce Lee, we're going to end with Bruce Lee. 

“Don't fear the person that has 10,000 different kicks; fear the person that's done one kick 10,000 times.”

Ryan Foland: I love that. 

And don't be deceived because you may have listened to this and been like, "Oh my gosh, I have just acquired so much knowledge, I'm so satisfied, this is so great." 

Well, news flash is that it's easy to just acquire the information and that is satisfaction, but to truly implement it, and apply it, and test it, and try it, make it your own, that's where you become fulfilled. 

So I love the approach that you have, thanks for being so honest and ditching the act and letting us know that we are all in this together. 

But at the end of the day, it really is something that is exciting if you position it well, give yourself the space to work through it, and start doing that kick 10,000 times. 

Vinh Giang: Yeah, and just at the risk of repeating myself, can I kick the dead horse one more time?

Ryan Foland: Yes, please.

Vinh Giang: If you've never read the magic book, this is how most people would read a magic book. 

They are astonished by the trick, "I have to know how this trick is done." 

They read the magic book and they go, "Oh, yeah, I knew that's how they did it."

And then they never perform it. 

And that's how most people read either a self-development book or they read a book about how to build a business virtually or build a speaking career, is we read to fuel that sense of satisfaction that, "Oh, I know how it's done," but I'm pushing every listener who's listening right now — go out and perform that piece of magic. 

No matter how poorly you perform it, no matter how badly you do your first virtual, that's the price you have to pay to get good and to feel fulfilled. 

Ryan Foland: So if somebody wants to follow you, I know it's askvinh, V- I-N-H that's on Twitter and Instagram. 

Where do people go to get more of you?

Vinh Giang: You could Google my name or you can just go to my workshop site which is at

Ryan Foland: All right buddy. 

Well hey, I look at life as a series of dots, and I'm excited to continue those dots on, follow what you have, maybe share another stage soon, and excited to see how this all pans out. 

So again, thanks for coming to the show on behalf of the World of Speakers. 

Let's just keep performing those pieces of magic and creating what will be a new way of using our instrument. 

You've heard it here, kick 10,000 times in the same way and your future will be defined by the amount of work that you put in, to the performance or the magic that you do. 

We are out.

Thanks again, Vinh, it was great. 

A bit about World of Speakers

World of Speakers is a bi-weekly podcast that helps people find their own voices, and teaches them how to use their voice to develop a speaking business. This special series of episodes has been created to help speakers navigate during the coronavirus crisis. 

Connect with Vinh Giang:

Did you enjoy the show? We’d love to know! Leave us a review on iTunes by following this link.

Listen to more interviews with expert speakers.


Average: 5 (1 vote)


See also:

  • World of Speakers E.117:  Michael Reddington | Mastering Conversational Engagement
    World of Speakers podcasts

    World of Speakers E.117: Michael Reddington | Mastering Conversational Engagement

  • World of Speakers E.116:  Park Howell | The Business of Story
    World of Speakers podcasts

    World of Speakers E.116: Park Howell | The Business of Story

  • World of Speakers E.115:  Jeff Harry | Unleashing Your Inner Speaker
    World of Speakers podcasts

    World of Speakers E.115: Jeff Harry | Unleashing Your Inner Speaker